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| ID | Category | Severity | Type | Date Submitted | Last Update | ||||||||
| 0001790 | [1003.1(2016/18)/Issue7+TC2] Base Definitions and Headers | Editorial | Clarification Requested | 2023-12-01 21:00 | 2024-01-18 17:12 | ||||||||
| Reporter | steffen | View Status | public | ||||||||||
| Assigned To | |||||||||||||
| Priority | normal | Resolution | Accepted As Marked | ||||||||||
| Status | Resolved | ||||||||||||
| Name | steffen | ||||||||||||
| Organization | |||||||||||||
| User Reference | |||||||||||||
| Section | langinfo.h | ||||||||||||
| Page Number | 276 | ||||||||||||
| Line Number | 9587 pp, 9611 pp | ||||||||||||
| Interp Status | --- | ||||||||||||
| Final Accepted Text | See Note: 0006630 | ||||||||||||
| Summary | 0001790: More info on *ALT* constants | ||||||||||||
| Description |
The *ALT* series is documented as alternative appropriate and alternative name which is completely non-descriptive. It seems the intent is that ALTMON_* is Long month names, in the grammatical form used when the month is named by itself. Ditto abbreviated. Ie in the wild (FreeBSD, Linux) and on the Unicode CLDR, but let me just quote a commit message of christos@FreeBSD.org i have seen fly by today, a bit abbreviated: The CLDR specification [1] defines three possible month formats: - Abbreviation (e.g Jan, Ιαν) - Full (e.g January, Ιανουαρίου) - Standalone (e.g January, Ιανουάριος) Many languages use different case endings depending on whether the month is referenced as a standalone word (nominative case), or in date context (genitive, partitive, etc.). sort(1)'s -M option currently sorts months by testing input against only the abbrevation format, which is essentially a substring of the full format. While this works fine for languages like English, where there are no cases, for languages where there is a different case ending between the abbreviation/full and standalone formats, it is not sufficient. For example, in Greek, "May" can take the following forms: Abbreviation: Μαΐ (genitive case) Full: Μαΐου (genitive case) Standalone: Μάιος (nominative case) If we use the standalone format in Greek, sort(1) will not able to match "Μαΐ" to "Μάιος" and the sort will fail. This change makes sort(1) test against all three formats. It also works when the input contains mixed formats. [1] https://cldr.unicode.org/translation/date-time/date-time-patterns [^] |
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| Desired Action | If so intended, please adjust the descriptions of the *ALT* series to match CLDR and be more self-descriptive as their are today. | ||||||||||||
| Tags | tc1-2024 | ||||||||||||
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Notes |
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(0006622) shware_systems (reporter) 2024-01-15 18:33 |
I thought the primary names were how locales represented the Gregorian calendar in a particular language, and ALT names were for how they might represent an alternate calendar like Chinese, Hebrew or even Mayan, each in a single grammar form. Handling multiple grammar cases is way more an unspecified extension that would likely need a formal proposal modifying XBD 7 to add to the standard, not simply modifying this header arbitrarily. |
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(0006625) steffen (reporter) 2024-01-17 00:00 |
I do not think so. (I would not have thought that ALT does the great to handle entire calendar systems?) |
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(0006629) shware_systems (reporter) 2024-01-18 17:08 |
Apologies, I was confusing the ALT and ERA constants, and it is ERA that represents other calendars. XBD 7 is explicit ALT strings are for the nominitive case, if a language has one, and no ALT is for the genitive case. The standard doesn't address additional cases like partitive so perhaps a proposal for that is warranted. |
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(0006630) nick (manager) 2024-01-18 17:11 |
D4 page and line numbers. Add to Application Usage, page 277 after line 9645: For languages having both a genitive (when used with a day number) and a nominative (no day number) case, the "alternative" month names described here are for use when a nominative case is required, see XREF 7.3.5.1 LC_TIME Locale Definition. |
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Issue History |
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| Date Modified | Username | Field | Change |
| 2023-12-01 21:00 | steffen | New Issue | |
| 2023-12-01 21:00 | steffen | Name | => steffen |
| 2023-12-01 21:00 | steffen | Section | => langinfo.h |
| 2023-12-01 21:00 | steffen | Page Number | => 276 |
| 2023-12-01 21:00 | steffen | Line Number | => 9587 pp, 9611 pp |
| 2024-01-15 18:33 | shware_systems | Note Added: 0006622 | |
| 2024-01-17 00:00 | steffen | Note Added: 0006625 | |
| 2024-01-18 17:08 | shware_systems | Note Added: 0006629 | |
| 2024-01-18 17:11 | nick | Note Added: 0006630 | |
| 2024-01-18 17:12 | nick | Interp Status | => --- |
| 2024-01-18 17:12 | nick | Final Accepted Text | => See Note: 0006630 |
| 2024-01-18 17:12 | nick | Status | New => Resolved |
| 2024-01-18 17:12 | nick | Resolution | Open => Accepted As Marked |
| 2024-01-18 17:12 | nick | Tag Attached: tc1-2024 | |
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